8th SPAWN

[jerry58]

Hi alpha male on clutch of eggs again.
I am keeping close eye on that young female as you can see she is positioned on top of the cave all ready.
Fingers crossed and hoping things go a bit smoother this time see how it goes.
All fry I had taken out of the cave from last spawn are doing very well and ok .

Jerry

[Joby]

Good luck with them

[Jo's Zebs]

Nice one

[John]

Congrats

[jerry58]

Hi
Just an update it a shame but none of the wrigglers survived this time and I intervened less than before and got a worse result .He kicked out the wrigglers as before but over 24 hour period there was 17 in all.I know now that this is not due to the young female hassling him as she was in her own cave all the time and I know the water levels are good(checked them again today to make sure).
Now my next thing to try is to remove the eggs on the 4th day (If I get the chance to) as previous spawns and this one they hatch on the 5th or 6th day and keep them in a breeder trap I have been successful with smaller amount of eggs (1 or 2)so will give it a go.Might have a look at investing in a egg tumbler.
Just can't work out what is going wrong and it is a process of elimination.
Other than that they just might need to rest up for a while.
Only time will tell.

Jerry

Pics of some the dead wrigglers

[Stevie.K]

Sorry to hear your bad news Jerry, it seems strange to have a full batch die at that stage without something major being wrong.
You say all your levels are ok, & with you raising plenty of fry I would guess this isn't your problem.
I lost my first batch of fry due to nitrate levels so I guess you have tested for this?
Hope you get to the bottom of it.

[jerry58]

Hi Stevie

Thanks for that.
I checked my water parameters as soon as,after they died and they were as they have been all the time.

Nitrite 0
Nitrate 12.5
Ph 7.5
Kh 3 to 5
Gh 5 to 7

I try to keep on the lower side to keep Ph down as much as pos but this does not change a great deal (just as I want it )the above readings are to keep in line with the parameters on the breeding section on Zebrapleco front page.(IMO I think lower Ph keeps eggs in better condition)
I won't use Ph down as think it complicates it more and that my Ph reading is ok my fish have bred in these conditions so can't be them.

It all went wrong when
1.I removed the fry he had banked up from the 1st to the 5th spawn there was so many. They caused eggs to be kicked out of cave.
2.6th spawn
He had a failed trapping in his cave with alpha female then next day trapped her again in his cave. Thats ok.
3.7th spawn
He trapped the female in her own cave next to his,so I moved him and the eggs in the cave after the female came out,to the original position of his cave,as the female was trying to get in the cave where he and the eggs were thinking it was hers.This was ok and all back to normal.
4. 8th spawn
This time he trapped the young female the day before in the cave next to his but was out next day with alpha female in his cave.That was ok.
I don't think this has affected the outcome of dead wrigglers.
I think he is a bit worn out and killing them.I looked to take out the remaining wrigglers this last spawn(they were very healthy and very mobile there was 6)I left them in to give him the a chance by the morning all dead!.

Sorry all a bit confusing.

So my conclusion is they are ok up to hatching (he looks after them well)after then they die (got to be him WHY who knows).
Thus this next time will take eggs out on the 4th day and see what happens.

Will keep you posted maybe saying about this on here might help some one with same problem at a later date.

Jerry

[Joby]

Gutting to hear they didn't make it

Hope you get succesful wrigglers soon