Irony has a way of putting discussions at a rest. I do hope this forum never gets to the point where the mods are always right and the rest are expected to wag their tails, or expect to get whipped.
With this I rest my posting at this forum for a while
Zebras in US ( Aquabid )
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jerms55555
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 360
- Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2004 6:50 pm
- Location: Los Angeles
To be honest you two had some pretty good valid points...but in the end lets drink some Jack Daniels and be happy!!! 
I honestly wasn't upset. I'm not terribly fond of Jack Daniels though, can we just make it a cold beer? 
I wasn't criticizing anyone, I just take quite a lot of flak from people that find out I have zebras and will potentially have fry for sale. I'd love to hear what other people that own zebras intend to do with them. I'm not sure why it needs to be a big trade secret, to be honest.
Barbie
I wasn't criticizing anyone, I just take quite a lot of flak from people that find out I have zebras and will potentially have fry for sale. I'd love to hear what other people that own zebras intend to do with them. I'm not sure why it needs to be a big trade secret, to be honest.Barbie
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Dan D' Man
- Groupie
- Posts: 48
- Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:54 pm
- Location: Miami, Florida
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jerms55555
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 360
- Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2004 6:50 pm
- Location: Los Angeles
If I ever get my zebras to spawn I will honestly probably sell them what the market wants to pay for them...As of right now I probably start off at $100...thats pretty reasonable IMO....but I know I would go to my LFS and sell two or three for 25-30 each, but knowing that the LFS wont sell them over $50...I see alot of young kids who are pretty knowledgeable and would love to have one swimming in their tanks....I remember when I was young (13) and saved my allowance to buy a $40 zebra and would sit all day looking at him. I would love for a kid to do the same.......
In the end money comes and goes, but memories last a lifetime.....until you drink a few beers to kill your brain cells....cheers...I'll take a beer too, Barbie!!!!!
In the end money comes and goes, but memories last a lifetime.....until you drink a few beers to kill your brain cells....cheers...I'll take a beer too, Barbie!!!!!
Last edited by jerms55555 on Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Shell231
- Mentally Certified!
- Posts: 650
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 11:49 am
- Location: St Leonards on sea E Sussex
As many people said i have been offered fry at 1" and a half for £25 i just think it is steap, i am intitled to an opinion aint i!Barbie wrote:Did you actually read the auction? It's for 3 fish, and he pays the shipping. 2 F1 zebras just sold for 140 dollars EACH at the same size. Kevin is starting the auction at 100 dollars each, and he'll pay the shipping. That's still cheaper than you guys can buy them on your side of the pond, either way, and the ones that come available over there ARE being purchased, even at the high prices, no?
Barbie
Sure you are Shell. Where exactly did I say you weren't? An opinion and slander can be two entirely different things and one in the same. In your opinion he shouldn't ask so much for them, and in my opinion he put the hard work, experience, losses, and everything else involved into making those fry, so the only person who really has a right to say what is enough or not is the person selling them, no?
Why haven't you already snapped up fry at that price? Just out of curiousity?
Barbie
Why haven't you already snapped up fry at that price? Just out of curiousity?
Barbie
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Guest
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kkorotev1
After years of giving these fry away to friends...
of donating these fry to fish clubs and church clubs alike...
of writing in this forum and others EVERYTHING I know about this fish
and
of answering every email from every wanna-be breeder with the ability to hit "send"...
THEN....THEN I'll list my fish on AQUABID with the sole intention of making back a buck or two.
and I do it because I've earned the right.
How about you?
Thank-you, Barbie.
Kevin Korotev
of donating these fry to fish clubs and church clubs alike...
of writing in this forum and others EVERYTHING I know about this fish
and
of answering every email from every wanna-be breeder with the ability to hit "send"...
THEN....THEN I'll list my fish on AQUABID with the sole intention of making back a buck or two.
and I do it because I've earned the right.
How about you?
Thank-you, Barbie.
Kevin Korotev
I agree completely with the point that Barbie is making. It's nice to think that everybody can afford to be eternally altruistic, but at some stage there has to be allowances for personal sacrifice and compensation.
There's nothing wrong with wanting to make back some of what you put into the keeping and raising of these fish, especially if it means that people who are doing it successfully can continue to do so.
There's nothing wrong with wanting to make back some of what you put into the keeping and raising of these fish, especially if it means that people who are doing it successfully can continue to do so.
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Guest
I can vouch for Kevins integrity as I have done business with him but that is not what we are talking here, it is the market value of zebras and normally it dictates on how much a buyer who are willing to pay for them, right now a fish cost more than a months sallary in some third world country and we are making a big fuss about it, and still the price is still rising.
If I want them that badly I would pay for them but I already got plenty, if you are thinking of getting some for the purpose of breeding them at this size you are better off buying at least 8-12 fish to ensure a good breeding colony not to mention some of the fry wont survive to breeding size and you can also ask to buy from different breeding stock just to improve the fishes gene pool
If I want them that badly I would pay for them but I already got plenty, if you are thinking of getting some for the purpose of breeding them at this size you are better off buying at least 8-12 fish to ensure a good breeding colony not to mention some of the fry wont survive to breeding size and you can also ask to buy from different breeding stock just to improve the fishes gene pool
WOW
Looks like I've been missing all the excitement!!! Sorry to join in so late, but surprisingly enough, I've been working away again!!!! One day work will need to take a back seat to my zebras, (oh and wife).
This is a touchy subject and one that I can sympathis with entirely.
Kevin, barbie you have a very valid point, breedig these fish isn't just about the money, and it isn't just about saving the world!
McEve, ( i hope you are still reading this as I will miss you dearly if you are not) You also have a very valued point, as commercialism is drastically overtaking the reason behind breeding this beautifiul fish.
I do not mean to sit on the fence with this one, but I have the same arguement in my head every time someone asks me what price I am selling ym fish for. It is one of those dilemas that has neither a right or wrong answer. Both options have their benefits and downsides.
I have been offered anything from £80 to £200 per fish, and these are at present around the 2" mark. Like Kevin I have an e-mail list of over 200 people wanting some when they are ready. This makes things slightly tricky as unless I discover some amazing duplicating machine, I cannot met demands. So I have decided that Forum members get first refusal, at a price way below what I could get for them If I let them go to the highest bidder. This, some would say is eliteist! I would have to agree, but it is the only criteria I have to go on, plus I know the people on this forum have a genuine interest, and are not in it purely for financial gain.
If I was in it for the money, I would not ( as Kevin has so rightly pointed out) write articles, set up a website, answer at least 10 e-mails a day, take numerous phone calls, set up a forum.....open my house for people to "pop in" and view my fish.
As many of you have experienced, when I got my first fry, all I wanted to do was tell everyone how I did it. This would hopefully mean they would not need to wait the five years for it to happen as I did.
Ok, I'm rambling a bit, but I'm trying to let you into my head, to show that I understand the Turmoil that is taking place in the heads of members such as barbie, McEve and Kevin.
Barbie has often said she is confused as to the price the fish should be sold for. I also have this problem, as you have all probably noticed. It is not an easy decision, but the cold hard facts are that there are certain things that must be taken into account. This said, I wholey disagree about the topend prices being asked. BUt.... as far as I can see no-one is asking top end prices on this forum.
Ok...........lets put my management hat on. I quite my job, and start up a zebra pleco business, selling them online to anyone and everyone.
I know I can get £150 per fish, Lets say I get 80 fish per year. it costs me around £3000 to set it all up, pay for food, electric etc. So I make £9,000 to pay for my wages. (this obviously is very simplified).
Alternatively...... I sell only to those I know.... at a Price they were 4 years ago....£40...... I make...£3200....whoops... I'm bankrupt!
This may seem irrelevant, but I am giving an example to try and show that we must hit a happy medium. We do not know how many kevin, or Barbie, OfrJoe Blogs have sold, or for what price. But I certainly do not condone offering the odd fish, for what ever someone is "WILLING" to pay for it. It is personal choice!!! WHich Is what this forum is all about.
I am very , very proud of this forum, and get a complete slaggin from my mates when I tell them about it. I am proud of the forum because I genuinely think we are all making a tiny little bit of a difference. The only reason this has happened is because, we can quite freely vent our opinions.
It would appear to me, joining this post late, that no boundaries have been crossed, and NO personal insults have been made. We have just expressed two opposing sides of a coin.
Prices will fluctuate.....whatever happens, nobody has an obligation to try and control that. Although,,,,....the more we breed, the less they will cost!!!! Nothing would make me happier than to see the prices drop to £20 per fish, but I do not have the commercial power, (nor does anone else breeding these fish). I could sell all mine at £20 per head, but the other 130 people who couldn't buy them will still pay over £100.
I must end this now, as I am sure it has made little or no sense at all, but in short.
Thank you all for expressing an opinion, . There is more I could rattle on about, but I will no doubt send you passing out into your keyboards.
In short, we all have our opinions, and nobody is forcing these onto anyone else. PLEASE do not let this get in the way the friendships we have worked so hard to develope over previous months.
Make mine mine a bud!!!!!!
Cheers Guys.
Rob
Looks like I've been missing all the excitement!!! Sorry to join in so late, but surprisingly enough, I've been working away again!!!! One day work will need to take a back seat to my zebras, (oh and wife).
This is a touchy subject and one that I can sympathis with entirely.
Kevin, barbie you have a very valid point, breedig these fish isn't just about the money, and it isn't just about saving the world!
McEve, ( i hope you are still reading this as I will miss you dearly if you are not) You also have a very valued point, as commercialism is drastically overtaking the reason behind breeding this beautifiul fish.
I do not mean to sit on the fence with this one, but I have the same arguement in my head every time someone asks me what price I am selling ym fish for. It is one of those dilemas that has neither a right or wrong answer. Both options have their benefits and downsides.
I have been offered anything from £80 to £200 per fish, and these are at present around the 2" mark. Like Kevin I have an e-mail list of over 200 people wanting some when they are ready. This makes things slightly tricky as unless I discover some amazing duplicating machine, I cannot met demands. So I have decided that Forum members get first refusal, at a price way below what I could get for them If I let them go to the highest bidder. This, some would say is eliteist! I would have to agree, but it is the only criteria I have to go on, plus I know the people on this forum have a genuine interest, and are not in it purely for financial gain.
If I was in it for the money, I would not ( as Kevin has so rightly pointed out) write articles, set up a website, answer at least 10 e-mails a day, take numerous phone calls, set up a forum.....open my house for people to "pop in" and view my fish.
As many of you have experienced, when I got my first fry, all I wanted to do was tell everyone how I did it. This would hopefully mean they would not need to wait the five years for it to happen as I did.
Ok, I'm rambling a bit, but I'm trying to let you into my head, to show that I understand the Turmoil that is taking place in the heads of members such as barbie, McEve and Kevin.
Barbie has often said she is confused as to the price the fish should be sold for. I also have this problem, as you have all probably noticed. It is not an easy decision, but the cold hard facts are that there are certain things that must be taken into account. This said, I wholey disagree about the topend prices being asked. BUt.... as far as I can see no-one is asking top end prices on this forum.
Ok...........lets put my management hat on. I quite my job, and start up a zebra pleco business, selling them online to anyone and everyone.
I know I can get £150 per fish, Lets say I get 80 fish per year. it costs me around £3000 to set it all up, pay for food, electric etc. So I make £9,000 to pay for my wages. (this obviously is very simplified).
Alternatively...... I sell only to those I know.... at a Price they were 4 years ago....£40...... I make...£3200....whoops... I'm bankrupt!
This may seem irrelevant, but I am giving an example to try and show that we must hit a happy medium. We do not know how many kevin, or Barbie, OfrJoe Blogs have sold, or for what price. But I certainly do not condone offering the odd fish, for what ever someone is "WILLING" to pay for it. It is personal choice!!! WHich Is what this forum is all about.
I am very , very proud of this forum, and get a complete slaggin from my mates when I tell them about it. I am proud of the forum because I genuinely think we are all making a tiny little bit of a difference. The only reason this has happened is because, we can quite freely vent our opinions.
It would appear to me, joining this post late, that no boundaries have been crossed, and NO personal insults have been made. We have just expressed two opposing sides of a coin.
Prices will fluctuate.....whatever happens, nobody has an obligation to try and control that. Although,,,,....the more we breed, the less they will cost!!!!
Nothing would make me happier than to see the prices drop to £20 per fish, but I do not have the commercial power, (nor does anone else breeding these fish). I could sell all mine at £20 per head, but the other 130 people who couldn't buy them will still pay over £100.I must end this now, as I am sure it has made little or no sense at all, but in short.
Thank you all for expressing an opinion,
. There is more I could rattle on about, but I will no doubt send you passing out into your keyboards.In short, we all have our opinions, and nobody is forcing these onto anyone else. PLEASE do not let this get in the way the friendships we have worked so hard to develope over previous months.
Make mine mine a bud!!!!!!
Cheers Guys.
Rob
The perfect white lie..."Of course I didn't pay that much for the fish honey"
Yeow! I didn't see anything in this thread that was hrutful enugh to make anyone go away. If they do it's because of some issue of their own.
I bought fry from Barbie and I am thrilled. They're about an inch long or so, I don't remember when thney were born but it was before early 2005, so they're probably bigger than Kevin's.
Incidentally, Kevin is a straight shooter. I know this because though I've not had transactions with him I've attempted to;) I've also talked to a lot of people about p[lecs in general and his nae is always among the first and most often mentioned. HE rocks.
And so does Barbie. She didn't HAVE ot sell me ANYTHING at ANY price, but she sold me fish she was holding back for herself, at a great price. AND she threw in a couple of l260 fry for free. Barbie's one of those that always delivers more than she promises.
As to the price- It's an open free market. That means the seller's free to charge anything they like and the buyer's free to pay anything they like. If a seller prices himself out of the market, he wont' sell any fish. If he underprices, he's also making a mistake. And if a buyer sets his price ceiling too low, he'll never get any fish at any size!
I bought fry because I was impatient to own, patient to spawn. I can wait for a year or two or as long as it will take, I'm in no hurry. THe goal isn't to get it done fast, it's to get it done right. I hope to buy a few more from a different source so I have fish from different gene pools. WE'll see. Ken W, you out there?;)
I bought fry from Barbie and I am thrilled. They're about an inch long or so, I don't remember when thney were born but it was before early 2005, so they're probably bigger than Kevin's.
Incidentally, Kevin is a straight shooter. I know this because though I've not had transactions with him I've attempted to;) I've also talked to a lot of people about p[lecs in general and his nae is always among the first and most often mentioned. HE rocks.
And so does Barbie. She didn't HAVE ot sell me ANYTHING at ANY price, but she sold me fish she was holding back for herself, at a great price. AND she threw in a couple of l260 fry for free. Barbie's one of those that always delivers more than she promises.
As to the price- It's an open free market. That means the seller's free to charge anything they like and the buyer's free to pay anything they like. If a seller prices himself out of the market, he wont' sell any fish. If he underprices, he's also making a mistake. And if a buyer sets his price ceiling too low, he'll never get any fish at any size!
I bought fry because I was impatient to own, patient to spawn. I can wait for a year or two or as long as it will take, I'm in no hurry. THe goal isn't to get it done fast, it's to get it done right. I hope to buy a few more from a different source so I have fish from different gene pools. WE'll see. Ken W, you out there?;)
