Dave why would politics warrant making a thread on a zebra forum a sticky?
Barbie
Why is a Zebra Plec like a bank account?
Hi
Hi Barbie
Well this thread has developed along different lines, a view is posted and then people suggest the opposite and it's called debate.
The references to war and patriotism or pro US is inviting people to state their opinions on these subjects.
I think we can all agree on one thing, that this is a very emotive subject and the way some threads have developed ( not in a logical manner ) who knows where it can lead.
I have my views, and many other people do to. We do not know much about each other on this site, and if this thread continued people may take great offence.
In the past the bashing of Political Leaders has been frowned upon, but if it was Pro, I am sure it would attract the anti comments.
I also cannot see how this has any relevance to the Zebra.
Dave
Well this thread has developed along different lines, a view is posted and then people suggest the opposite and it's called debate.
The references to war and patriotism or pro US is inviting people to state their opinions on these subjects.
I think we can all agree on one thing, that this is a very emotive subject and the way some threads have developed ( not in a logical manner ) who knows where it can lead.
I have my views, and many other people do to. We do not know much about each other on this site, and if this thread continued people may take great offence.
In the past the bashing of Political Leaders has been frowned upon, but if it was Pro, I am sure it would attract the anti comments.
I also cannot see how this has any relevance to the Zebra.
Dave
Re: Hi
We don't want to go there. Politics (and religiondave wrote: The references to war and patriotism or pro US is inviting people to state their opinions on these subjects.
) is not this sites purpose. We are talking about Zebra Plecos. Period.-
madmoroccan
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Religion and politics are the prime causes of war. But who cares? We are here to discuss L046.
I missed commenting on this one because there are a whole load of emotions floating about. I must say that I was one of those people "whinging" about expensive prices that Barbie was refering to. My first action apon joining this board was to start a similar thread to this one. And YES these fish are way too expensive! I don't care if they come with bells and whistles! They are way too costly for comfort.
Which brings me back to another arguement... If these fish weren't so expensive they may stand a fighting chance in the wild. Only last week did I have a full blown shouting match with somebody at my LFS who was bragging about the group of 8 wild caught that he had "recently" purchased. The high prices not only guarantee show offs, but also greedy profiteers into aquiring some. So, the prices are there to keep less serious enthusiasts away are they? LOL give me a break!
The good thing to come out of all these debates is that we are all passionate about our fish. And to cap it all off there are many people on this forum who are breeding and silently approaching people with right attitude with fry for less than half of the current "market price".
How do I know this?
I have bought my own group for a VERY reasonable price. And have since been offered fish by other breeders for similar prices.
In the end all you have to do is wait. There are many people out there who have fish ready to go to the right people and they will find you.
For that I can hand on heart say that although I don't like Dave, I 100% commend him for the efforts he is putting into spreading the fish around and in investing in people.
To stop high prices all you have to do is ignore sellers that are bieng greedy. Don't like the cost of something? Don't buy it. Patience is a darn good thing when it comes to our hobby.
I missed commenting on this one because there are a whole load of emotions floating about. I must say that I was one of those people "whinging" about expensive prices that Barbie was refering to. My first action apon joining this board was to start a similar thread to this one. And YES these fish are way too expensive! I don't care if they come with bells and whistles! They are way too costly for comfort.
Which brings me back to another arguement... If these fish weren't so expensive they may stand a fighting chance in the wild. Only last week did I have a full blown shouting match with somebody at my LFS who was bragging about the group of 8 wild caught that he had "recently" purchased. The high prices not only guarantee show offs, but also greedy profiteers into aquiring some. So, the prices are there to keep less serious enthusiasts away are they? LOL give me a break!
The good thing to come out of all these debates is that we are all passionate about our fish. And to cap it all off there are many people on this forum who are breeding and silently approaching people with right attitude with fry for less than half of the current "market price".
How do I know this?
I have bought my own group for a VERY reasonable price. And have since been offered fish by other breeders for similar prices.
In the end all you have to do is wait. There are many people out there who have fish ready to go to the right people and they will find you.
For that I can hand on heart say that although I don't like Dave, I 100% commend him for the efforts he is putting into spreading the fish around and in investing in people.
To stop high prices all you have to do is ignore sellers that are bieng greedy. Don't like the cost of something? Don't buy it. Patience is a darn good thing when it comes to our hobby.
[img]http://www.geocities.com/madmoroccan/zebcam.jpg[/img]
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Alistair
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Here Here, Good things come to those who waitTo stop high prices all you have to do is ignore sellers that are bieng greedy. Don't like the cost of something? Don't buy it. Patience is a darn good thing when it comes to our hobby.
I waited ~ 8 months to get the companions for my fish when I got back into them last year and it was worth every second
God I am glad someone besides me and crazy.eddie agrees with us on this. One day I will join the ranks of L046 ownership. Now I understand about Tom dancing when he got his! All I can do for now is sit back and read the forums and learn. But hopefully its just a matter of time.
I could'nt agree more.In the end all you have to do is wait. There are many people out there who have fish ready to go to the right people and they will find you.
To stop high prices all you have to do is ignore sellers that are bieng greedy. Don't like the cost of something? Don't buy it. Patience is a darn good thing when it comes to our hobby.
Bobby
Hi
A fact, only 43 registered breeders, so I'm a bit unsure why everybody who gets this fish is so convinced they are going to breed them.
I know of others as well, and others who have them but not breeding them.
The people who have taken my fish so far from this site have a record of breeding Corys, Discus, Killis and other species of Hypancistrus. So it's not entirely random.
Yes the fish is expensive, but why shouldn't somebody who pays a lot of money for a fish expect the same.
Also a holiday can cost more than 6 of these fish, a new sofa, etc.
I was brought up to save for something I really wanted and make sacrifices.
The people I have got involved with so far regarding this fish I really do trust ( this is outside the forum as well ) and I really do believe they with their experience have a chance of breeding this fish.
I know it's personal judgement, but all you people advocating cheaper prices, please breed some first.
If somebody said to me they were breeding L260's, 236, 340 and the list is endless really, I would consider an exchange of young fish, not only would this demonstrate fish keeping capabilities, also relieve to a small extent the pressure of other species in the wild.
Dave
I know of others as well, and others who have them but not breeding them.
The people who have taken my fish so far from this site have a record of breeding Corys, Discus, Killis and other species of Hypancistrus. So it's not entirely random.
Yes the fish is expensive, but why shouldn't somebody who pays a lot of money for a fish expect the same.
Also a holiday can cost more than 6 of these fish, a new sofa, etc.
I was brought up to save for something I really wanted and make sacrifices.
The people I have got involved with so far regarding this fish I really do trust ( this is outside the forum as well ) and I really do believe they with their experience have a chance of breeding this fish.
I know it's personal judgement, but all you people advocating cheaper prices, please breed some first.
If somebody said to me they were breeding L260's, 236, 340 and the list is endless really, I would consider an exchange of young fish, not only would this demonstrate fish keeping capabilities, also relieve to a small extent the pressure of other species in the wild.
Dave
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crazie.eddie
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Re: Hi
Hmm... You buy 6 young fish, in a few years, they get older. If you wish, you can sell them. Even with the time and money spent raising the fish, the cost of 3 adult zebras will give you a profit.dave wrote: Yes the fish is expensive, but why shouldn't somebody who pays a lot of money for a fish expect the same.
Dave
If you decide to breed them, you then produce more fish. Basically, an almost endless manufacturing plant. All you do is feed and house them, the zebras do most of the work.
I'm working on it.dave wrote: I know it's personal judgement, but all you people advocating cheaper prices, please breed some first.
Dave
I am setting up now just for this purpose. I was considering the L129's.If somebody said to me they were breeding L260's, 236, 340 and the list is endless really, I would consider an exchange of young fish, not only would this demonstrate fish keeping capabilities, also relieve to a small extent the pressure of other species in the wild.
Bobby
Hi
Well Rhino
You are a long way away, hope you find somebody closer who will offer the same deal.
Even if you don't I don't think you will have a problem selling any young.
Just one word of advice, try and pick a fish that has been bred before at least you will have some guidance on how to go about it.
Good luck
Dave
@
Crazie Eddie, I agree with everything you say, but I would hazard a guess that the majority of people who are breeding have paid the post ban prices and are still doing so. Myself included.
The biggest problem I think is that when people start breeding is they expect an instant return.
I if I had decided to release all the fish I had bred in the last 9 months at current market prices I would have recovered my total outlay on this fish and more. But the way I am approaching it, well it could take me 3 to 4 years or forever.
And probably the best approach in the short term would be only to supply Zebras to people who are currently breeding them ( I don't do this ), it would definately lead to an increase in the numbers available hence relieve pressure on the wild stock.
Take care
Dave
You are a long way away, hope you find somebody closer who will offer the same deal.
Even if you don't I don't think you will have a problem selling any young.
Just one word of advice, try and pick a fish that has been bred before at least you will have some guidance on how to go about it.
Good luck
Dave
@
Crazie Eddie, I agree with everything you say, but I would hazard a guess that the majority of people who are breeding have paid the post ban prices and are still doing so. Myself included.
The biggest problem I think is that when people start breeding is they expect an instant return.
I if I had decided to release all the fish I had bred in the last 9 months at current market prices I would have recovered my total outlay on this fish and more. But the way I am approaching it, well it could take me 3 to 4 years or forever.
And probably the best approach in the short term would be only to supply Zebras to people who are currently breeding them ( I don't do this ), it would definately lead to an increase in the numbers available hence relieve pressure on the wild stock.
Take care
Dave
I think I will gain experience with L129's before I try to trade. I found this link for some breeding tips.Well Rhino
You are a long way away, hope you find somebody closer who will offer the same deal.
Even if you don't I don't think you will have a problem selling any young.
Just one word of advice, try and pick a fish that has been bred before at least you will have some guidance on how to go about it.
Good luck
http://www.zebrapleco.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8695
If you have any suggestions I'd love to hear them.
Bobby
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crazie.eddie
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Re: Hi
I agree, if business were run that way, nobody would buy anything. It's just, the greater the demand and the more it's mass produced, the cheaper things should be. That's how economics is. It's just, zebras breeders are like gas companies. Big colaboration on prices. "You don't like the price, don't buy it" mentality.dave wrote:
The biggest problem I think is that when people start breeding is they expect an instant return.
Dave
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Plastic Mac
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crazie.eddie
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Nobody really thought about it though. The demand is there and people are willing to buy it at the market price. But as I mentioned before, due to the demand and the price they are selling for, tempts those who want to make money to illegally export them from Brazil. What happens when the governments realize that this is still happening? They might put a ban on buying zebras.
I love zebras. I would love to breed them and have them on several tanks, but I could never really afford them. I see so many posts that many pleco anthusaists love them as well, but cannot warrant to buy them at the price. Sure I'm fortunate enough to make a few calls, get in my car, and pick up a juvenile zebra, all within 30 minutes.
I can understand buying wild zebras at high cost, but there are so many tank bred zebras globally it made me think. Why such a high price for tank bred zebras? Not finding a good reason, I figure I'll buy my own (AT MARKET PRICE), raise them, and hopefully breed them and sell them at a price which I think are reasonable. This is my goal. Sure, I'm one person. Sure, I'll lose money at first, but anyone who owns/runs a business knows this.
I love zebras. I would love to breed them and have them on several tanks, but I could never really afford them. I see so many posts that many pleco anthusaists love them as well, but cannot warrant to buy them at the price. Sure I'm fortunate enough to make a few calls, get in my car, and pick up a juvenile zebra, all within 30 minutes.
I can understand buying wild zebras at high cost, but there are so many tank bred zebras globally it made me think. Why such a high price for tank bred zebras? Not finding a good reason, I figure I'll buy my own (AT MARKET PRICE), raise them, and hopefully breed them and sell them at a price which I think are reasonable. This is my goal. Sure, I'm one person. Sure, I'll lose money at first, but anyone who owns/runs a business knows this.
