My first spawn...
- mistern2005
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:44 am
- Location: Tucson, Arizona
My first spawn...
After about 4 long years my zebra plecos spawned yesterday sometime and I noticed the eggs in one of the caves this morning.
I had been letting the tank go through a "dry season" cycle for the past 6-8 weeks. Basically I have not been doing any water changes and letting the TDS creep up through evaporation and supplementing a GH Booster (Seachem's RO Right). I actually checked the aquarium last night (before I was aware of the spawn) and the TDS was at 275 and added more RO Right trying to push the TDS close to 400. The plan was to start doing water changes with RO water at the beginning of the year to simulate the rainy season. Apparently that wasn't necessary as neglecting all major maintenance was all it took.
The past several months, the alpha female (Dorothy) had trapped the alpha male (Blackie) in his cave. It is suppose to be the other way around. Yesterday I thought I saw Dorothy trap him again. But what I saw was the beta male (Lloyd) trap Dorothy. The mistake was due to the fact that Lloyd and Dorothy have very similar stripe patterns and are hard to distinguish without seeing their heads. And when one traps another in the cave all you can really see is the one doing the trapping.
Nevertheless, this morning Lloyd was in one of the clay caves guarding a clutch of eggs! I am very excited, but I know this is just a first step. Frequently the first spawn is infertile or the father doesn't know how to keep after the eggs. BUT, it is VERY encouraging they are starting to spawn. I hope this clutch makes it and I have babies in the next several days. At the very least, from what I've read, once the first spawn happens, future spawns are far more common.
The only real difference as of late has been that I started feeding the zebras a very small mix of live foods. I fed blackworms for about a week (several weeks ago) and started feeding grindal worms, as much as my culture would allow. Seriously, I did northing else.
I won't be counting my "chickens" until they hatch, but I am very EXCITED!!! Nearly four years to the day when I got first two baby zebra plecos, I've had my first spawn!
I had been letting the tank go through a "dry season" cycle for the past 6-8 weeks. Basically I have not been doing any water changes and letting the TDS creep up through evaporation and supplementing a GH Booster (Seachem's RO Right). I actually checked the aquarium last night (before I was aware of the spawn) and the TDS was at 275 and added more RO Right trying to push the TDS close to 400. The plan was to start doing water changes with RO water at the beginning of the year to simulate the rainy season. Apparently that wasn't necessary as neglecting all major maintenance was all it took.
The past several months, the alpha female (Dorothy) had trapped the alpha male (Blackie) in his cave. It is suppose to be the other way around. Yesterday I thought I saw Dorothy trap him again. But what I saw was the beta male (Lloyd) trap Dorothy. The mistake was due to the fact that Lloyd and Dorothy have very similar stripe patterns and are hard to distinguish without seeing their heads. And when one traps another in the cave all you can really see is the one doing the trapping.
Nevertheless, this morning Lloyd was in one of the clay caves guarding a clutch of eggs! I am very excited, but I know this is just a first step. Frequently the first spawn is infertile or the father doesn't know how to keep after the eggs. BUT, it is VERY encouraging they are starting to spawn. I hope this clutch makes it and I have babies in the next several days. At the very least, from what I've read, once the first spawn happens, future spawns are far more common.
The only real difference as of late has been that I started feeding the zebras a very small mix of live foods. I fed blackworms for about a week (several weeks ago) and started feeding grindal worms, as much as my culture would allow. Seriously, I did northing else.
I won't be counting my "chickens" until they hatch, but I am very EXCITED!!! Nearly four years to the day when I got first two baby zebra plecos, I've had my first spawn!
L046 Breeders - 2M/3F / Lots of other L046 subadults and juveniles.
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Re: My first spawn...
Hi mistern2005
Congrats on the spawn.
When I want to keep an eye on the fish that are breeding I use the tail patterns to distinguish the fish as the tail is the only thing visible when there is a trapping also I do a detailed drawing of the tails this helps to remember them.
They do change the tail patterns slightly over longer periods of time I have found.
Hope this helps.
Jerry
Congrats on the spawn.
![Cool 8)](./images/smilies/icon_cool.gif)
When I want to keep an eye on the fish that are breeding I use the tail patterns to distinguish the fish as the tail is the only thing visible when there is a trapping also I do a detailed drawing of the tails this helps to remember them.
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
They do change the tail patterns slightly over longer periods of time I have found.
Hope this helps.
Jerry
Caution is a most valuable asset in fish keeping, especially if you are the fish.
- TwoTankAmin
- Moderator
- Posts: 1253
- Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:16 am
- Location: Westchester Co., NY
Re: My first spawn...
Congrats on the spawn ![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
BTW- the biggest male is quite often not the alpha male. Often the male who spawns the most (alpha) is a bit smaller. See my post near the bottom of this thread http://www.zebrapleco.com/forum/viewtop ... =12&t=5753
![Smile :-)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
BTW- the biggest male is quite often not the alpha male. Often the male who spawns the most (alpha) is a bit smaller. See my post near the bottom of this thread http://www.zebrapleco.com/forum/viewtop ... =12&t=5753
What makes the common person uncommon is common sense.
- mistern2005
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:44 am
- Location: Tucson, Arizona
Re: My first spawn...
TTA - that was a very interesting observation.
One of my pleco breeding buddies showed me a very subtle way to try to determine the alpha male is to look at the color of the odontodes. The alpha male will have whiter odontodes, whereas sub-dominant males have a slightly more brownish hue. Blackie, the largest male that didn't spawn, has very white odontodes, however Lloyd - the one on the eggs, has more subdued odontodes.
Not sure if this is fact, a hypothesis, a generality, or only true in a small number of cases.
Nonetheless, it's been a very happy time!
One of my pleco breeding buddies showed me a very subtle way to try to determine the alpha male is to look at the color of the odontodes. The alpha male will have whiter odontodes, whereas sub-dominant males have a slightly more brownish hue. Blackie, the largest male that didn't spawn, has very white odontodes, however Lloyd - the one on the eggs, has more subdued odontodes.
Not sure if this is fact, a hypothesis, a generality, or only true in a small number of cases.
Nonetheless, it's been a very happy time!
L046 Breeders - 2M/3F / Lots of other L046 subadults and juveniles.
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
- TwoTankAmin
- Moderator
- Posts: 1253
- Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2006 2:16 am
- Location: Westchester Co., NY
Re: My first spawn...
I judge alpha by which male spawns the most. ![Mr. Green :mrgreen:](./images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
![Mr. Green :mrgreen:](./images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
What makes the common person uncommon is common sense.
- mistern2005
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:44 am
- Location: Tucson, Arizona
Re: My first spawn...
I like your thinking! ![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
L046 Breeders - 2M/3F / Lots of other L046 subadults and juveniles.
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Re: My first spawn...
Congrats on the spawn you've had a long wait ![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
- mistern2005
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:44 am
- Location: Tucson, Arizona
Re: My first spawn...
Five days after the spawn, Lloyd has some wrigglers! I think there are only 3 or 4. It is hard to tell how many, as Lloyd covers them up really well in the cave. One of the fry went wayward nearly out of the cave and I got a gray look. I was surprised with the large size of the fry. I think one baby got past Lloyd, or was kicked out, but the little one seemingly got rescued.
This whole thing is amazing to me, the fact that there are wrigglers is very encouraging! I hear first spawns are often completely infertile. I'm hopeful I get at least one little survivor from the first spawn and the zebras and I get better at caring for the next spawn (if I'm so lucky!).
This whole thing is amazing to me, the fact that there are wrigglers is very encouraging! I hear first spawns are often completely infertile. I'm hopeful I get at least one little survivor from the first spawn and the zebras and I get better at caring for the next spawn (if I'm so lucky!).
L046 Breeders - 2M/3F / Lots of other L046 subadults and juveniles.
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
- mistern2005
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:44 am
- Location: Tucson, Arizona
Re: My first spawn...
There are an unconfirmed number of babies in the cave with Lloyd. He blocks the view of the babies, so getting any sort of count is darn near impossible. The most important thing - the spawn was (somewhat) successful! ![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
L046 Breeders - 2M/3F / Lots of other L046 subadults and juveniles.
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Re: My first spawn...
Nice one ![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
Re: My first spawn...
great news ![LOL dude! :loldude:](./images/smilies/lol.gif)
![LOL dude! :loldude:](./images/smilies/lol.gif)
Re: My first spawn...
nice, let me know if and when you want to sell
- mistern2005
- Obsessed!!
- Posts: 147
- Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:44 am
- Location: Tucson, Arizona
Re: My first spawn...
And here they are....there were a total of 5 in this spawn!!!
Here's one...
![Image](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k234/mistern2005/IMG_3742_2.jpg)
An action shot!
![Image](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k234/mistern2005/IMG_3741_2.jpg)
Four of the five...
![Image](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k234/mistern2005/IMG_3743_2.jpg)
Here's one...
![Image](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k234/mistern2005/IMG_3742_2.jpg)
An action shot!
![Image](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k234/mistern2005/IMG_3741_2.jpg)
Four of the five...
![Image](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k234/mistern2005/IMG_3743_2.jpg)
L046 Breeders - 2M/3F / Lots of other L046 subadults and juveniles.
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Lots of L144 - LF/SF, M/F, you name it...
Re: My first spawn...
So cute
![Love :luw:](./images/smilies/love.gif)
![Love :luw:](./images/smilies/love.gif)
![Love :luw:](./images/smilies/love.gif)
Re: My first spawn...
A big congrats, I know you have waited & tried everything to get them to spawn, and finally they have!
I think It sounds like your fish are well conditioned & happy & now rewarding you with fry!
Sometimes just leaving them to it is the best answer, as I have found out in the past.
I had fry from my first spawn, but lost these to high nitrates, the second spawn resulted in my ever biggest with 22 fry.
Keep up the good work![Applause :clap:](./images/smilies/clap.gif)
I think It sounds like your fish are well conditioned & happy & now rewarding you with fry!
Sometimes just leaving them to it is the best answer, as I have found out in the past.
I had fry from my first spawn, but lost these to high nitrates, the second spawn resulted in my ever biggest with 22 fry.
Keep up the good work
![Applause :clap:](./images/smilies/clap.gif)