Hi guys
I've just noticed one of the same. The fry are 10 days old (after hatching), and I have seen 2 out of 23, are bloated. This is the first time this has occured in this particulat tank, although I have seen it with the odd one in my other two tanks.
The current two are in a tank which contains bogwood, but neither of the other two tanks did. So I feel that rules out the bogwood (certainly for myself). The diet is also identical, crushed tetra prima, for the first 3-4 weeks, and then the addition of the odd bit of corgette. Only tetra prima for now however. ISO I don't thikn it is dietry, as it has only bee the odd fish that has been affected. I must admit however, this only seems to have happened to fry that are outwith the little breeder hangin in the tank. I will keep an eye on the remainer of my new fry to see if there are any in the breeder with the problem. Otherwise I will check the escapees, who are rumaging around the main tank.
good luck
rob
What's wrong with my baby?
Hi Rob,
Sorry to hear that you have also got similar problems to McEve. There definately appears to be a trend here, that's 3 people that have lost zebra fry to this bloating problem; McEve, Barbie and yourself. It may be an idea for the 3 of you to compare notes, you may stand a better chance of islolating the problem.
The problem appears to be occuring amongst very young fish, perhaps something is going wrong in the development stage that is not being influenced by any external factors.
Sorry to hear that you have also got similar problems to McEve. There definately appears to be a trend here, that's 3 people that have lost zebra fry to this bloating problem; McEve, Barbie and yourself. It may be an idea for the 3 of you to compare notes, you may stand a better chance of islolating the problem.
The problem appears to be occuring amongst very young fish, perhaps something is going wrong in the development stage that is not being influenced by any external factors.
My god, I'm reluctant to tell you what I just witnessed, as I wouldn't have believed it myself 
The affected fry I told you about in previous posting has been hanging on the front glass since this morning, large blistered tummy clear to see for all.
I just now went to feed the fry, and scared the fry in the process. It went for a launch, the one where you can't even see them move because of the speed you know? And he lost his blistered tummy!! To me it looks like the sudden chock he experienced emptied whatever it is that made his tummy large! he stayed on the glass for about half a minute, no more, then dropped to the ground, looked like he tested to see if he could move alright, then went into one of the caves to hide, like normal fry should do.
I swear his tummy went to normal in seconds
Now I'm even more confused as to what on earth this is!
The other fry also came out in the open and stuck to the side of the glass when his tummy was as large as shown on the pictures, I don't know why they would choose to come out in the open when feeling bad, but it looks like they do...
Update:
He's now back on the front glass again, tummy still bloated, but a third of what it was before. I did see wrong, it wasn't gone, only considerably smaller.
The affected fry I told you about in previous posting has been hanging on the front glass since this morning, large blistered tummy clear to see for all.
I just now went to feed the fry, and scared the fry in the process. It went for a launch, the one where you can't even see them move because of the speed you know? And he lost his blistered tummy!! To me it looks like the sudden chock he experienced emptied whatever it is that made his tummy large! he stayed on the glass for about half a minute, no more, then dropped to the ground, looked like he tested to see if he could move alright, then went into one of the caves to hide, like normal fry should do.
I swear his tummy went to normal in seconds
Now I'm even more confused as to what on earth this is!The other fry also came out in the open and stuck to the side of the glass when his tummy was as large as shown on the pictures, I don't know why they would choose to come out in the open when feeling bad, but it looks like they do...
Update:
He's now back on the front glass again, tummy still bloated, but a third of what it was before. I did see wrong, it wasn't gone, only considerably smaller.
Hi Mceve
Definately sounds like aprobelm with water retention. It must be associated with their fight or flight mechanism, i.e. empty everything out and conserve energy for getting away.
If this is a problem, themn they should be able to expell the water, yet they cannot regulate the amount taken in.
rob
Definately sounds like aprobelm with water retention. It must be associated with their fight or flight mechanism, i.e. empty everything out and conserve energy for getting away.
If this is a problem, themn they should be able to expell the water, yet they cannot regulate the amount taken in.
rob
The perfect white lie..."Of course I didn't pay that much for the fish honey"
Hi Rob, that makes sense.
So then we're over to what could be causing the problem with not being able to regulate the intake of water - or rather, not being able to balance it. Weird huh..... And like mentioned before, only fry from batch nr two has had this problem.
How did it go with the one you had?
I wonder if this helps?:
fry
AT first I thought it was the reflection of the lens in his tummy, but it's not. Additional photos show the same dark circle. Does your fry have this? Healthy ones or sick?
Edit:
It's 8pm now, and this is what he looks like now:
fry
So then we're over to what could be causing the problem with not being able to regulate the intake of water - or rather, not being able to balance it. Weird huh..... And like mentioned before, only fry from batch nr two has had this problem.
How did it go with the one you had?
I wonder if this helps?:
fry
AT first I thought it was the reflection of the lens in his tummy, but it's not. Additional photos show the same dark circle. Does your fry have this? Healthy ones or sick?
Edit:
It's 8pm now, and this is what he looks like now:
fry
-
Tom26000
Hi McEve
I am almost positive that the dark rings you point out are just the digestive tract of the fish. You can often see similar in young ancistrus.
The bloating definitely looks like fluid retention which would suggest some form of osmotic imbalance in the fish. This is unlikely to be infectious but as others have seemingly experienced the same with their young L046s nothing should be ruled out at this stage.
My only other thought is that the bloating is due to trapped gas in the fish, maybe cause by some food? Could it be the prima? I personally doubt it but you never know.
Good luck
Tom
I am almost positive that the dark rings you point out are just the digestive tract of the fish. You can often see similar in young ancistrus.
The bloating definitely looks like fluid retention which would suggest some form of osmotic imbalance in the fish. This is unlikely to be infectious but as others have seemingly experienced the same with their young L046s nothing should be ruled out at this stage.
My only other thought is that the bloating is due to trapped gas in the fish, maybe cause by some food? Could it be the prima? I personally doubt it but you never know.
Good luck
Tom
Hi Tom, thanks for the tip!
I've been reading up a bit on osmoregulation, and I'm now upping the hardness in the water just a tad to see if that will help. There's absolutely no measurable hardness in our tap water, and although Loricariidae wants soft water, it might not be considered correct with 0 hardness.
This might explain why it got better when I removed the bogwood, as I understand bogwood makes water softer, which might have counteracted any build up of hardness due to the rocks I have in the tank. This is pure speculation though, I'm not at all sure this is correct! It doesn't explain why the fry had a relapse - if it is the same fry - and it doesn't explain why Rob and Barbie has had fry that also experience bloating.
Maybe some fry are more susceptible to bloating due to water parameters than others..?
What are the hardness parameters in your water Rob and Barbie?
I've been reading up a bit on osmoregulation, and I'm now upping the hardness in the water just a tad to see if that will help. There's absolutely no measurable hardness in our tap water, and although Loricariidae wants soft water, it might not be considered correct with 0 hardness.
This might explain why it got better when I removed the bogwood, as I understand bogwood makes water softer, which might have counteracted any build up of hardness due to the rocks I have in the tank. This is pure speculation though, I'm not at all sure this is correct! It doesn't explain why the fry had a relapse - if it is the same fry - and it doesn't explain why Rob and Barbie has had fry that also experience bloating.
Maybe some fry are more susceptible to bloating due to water parameters than others..?
What are the hardness parameters in your water Rob and Barbie?
Hi Rob, it will be like christmas when you get your fish room up and running hey? 
Do you have KH and GH reading of your water Rob? It sure would help in the investigation of this as a possible reason...
This made for interesting readin btw: http://groups.msn.com/Breedingtropicalf ... ation.msnw
and
http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/water/osmoregulation.htm
Do you have KH and GH reading of your water Rob? It sure would help in the investigation of this as a possible reason...
This made for interesting readin btw: http://groups.msn.com/Breedingtropicalf ... ation.msnw
and
http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/water/osmoregulation.htm
Found some more:
Against this continuous movement of water into or out of the body, fish have to maintain a constant internal body fluid concentration – a process called osmoregulation. The greater the difference in concentration between the fish’s body fluids and the surrounding water – the greater the osmotic effect. As hard water is more concentrated than soft, there will be less difference and therefore less water influx and consequently the fish will not have to work so hard at osmoregulation. This is particularly important in cases of bacterial ulceration where water can flood into open tissues.
*If* it's a case of problem with osmoregulation my fry is experiencing, then maybe we're onto something here....
Against this continuous movement of water into or out of the body, fish have to maintain a constant internal body fluid concentration – a process called osmoregulation. The greater the difference in concentration between the fish’s body fluids and the surrounding water – the greater the osmotic effect. As hard water is more concentrated than soft, there will be less difference and therefore less water influx and consequently the fish will not have to work so hard at osmoregulation. This is particularly important in cases of bacterial ulceration where water can flood into open tissues.
*If* it's a case of problem with osmoregulation my fry is experiencing, then maybe we're onto something here....
