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I always thought that the amonia was an intermediate stage of the process and that the nitrifying bacteria in our filters did in fact break the amonia down into the nitrate that the plants used up. Does anyone have a biology book handy? It has been awhile since I looked any of this stuff up.

I just looked this up in my Biology of Seedplants textbook and unless you have some information specific to Aquatic plants, this book generalizes that nitrofying bacterium is responsible for the oxidation of ammonia to nitrite ions. Another genus of bacteria then oxidizes the nitrite to form nitrate ions. This is the form in which almost all nitrogen is absorbed by plants. I believe the general reference here is looking at soil. I am interested to know more about where you have found that the process is different in aquatic plants.

I am very curious.

Thanks,

Robert

No Ammonia (NH3/NH4) is the start of the process.

Cheers Adam, I thought i understood the nyrification process but it just got a bit more complicated for me too.

Sorry guys I had a two year old screaming for sweets in my ear hole while I was trying to post, hence the typo. Must go she wants to have a crap now, oh the joys of parenthood.

nitrate NO3-.
nitrate and ammonium (NO4+) ions.

Robert Hadath wrote: I am interested to know more about where you have found that the process is different in aquatic plants.

I believe the process would be the same, the problems/challenges/answer to aquiring a self maintaning, naturally balanced system, is something that has been researched quite extensively for a long time - what fish keeper wouldn't like to not having to change water all the time

The problem is that you have a very small concentrated, space to do it in, and the balance is very delicate to achieve. In nature there's a constant supply of new/fresh water in a healthy enviroment, but it doesn't take much to destroy this balance in nature either....

I understand salt water tanks are often set up so that the need for changing water is minimal, but the setup to achieve this is rather complicated and involves external filters with live rock for biological filtering so forth, and is rather expensiv. So for the fresh water I guess the best method of keeping a healthy system is still the old fashioned changing water in buckets method

It would be very interesting to know what your Nitrate reading in your tank is after 6 months without a water change. Mabybe you do have anareobic bacteria in your substrate that feeds off the Nitrate, but even so, I understand having anareobic bacteria in the substrate could be a ticking bomb as well.

This is mostly hearsay and personal opinions, and I'm sure there's more knowlegable people in this forum that can give you more precise information

Tristan wrote: I know that a lot of advice given in the fishkeeping industry is peddled through the large corporations in order to sell the aquarist more/ different products. One breeder i know does 25% water change every 4 days with untreated tap water and his fish are breeding like crazy. He recons that de-chlorination liquids are a waste of money and that in an aquarium the act of pouring the water into a tank will release most of the chlorine. Any one have any thoughts on this.

Tristan

I never use de-chlorination liquids. Wether you should use it or not depends on how much chlorine your local water supplier puts in the water I guess, but for me - I agree with the breeder you talked to

McEve
that is interesting to know, i have never really wanted to try with discus costing upto£90 per fish and 8 - 10 per tank i have always thought discression to be the better part of valour but i will try it with the malawis.

Thanks

Just another thought on the dechlorination thingy. As long as your tank is well airated you shouldnt need to add anything either, a fact that is born out for the reason that water authorities are now turning to Chloramine to treat there water as its far more stable and a complete pain for us aquarists to remove. Give me Chlorine in my water supply any day of the week.

Thats right Ewee the bond that chlorine forms with water is relatively easy to break, airation usually does the trick. Completely different story with Chloromine, this is usually removed mechanically or through the use of dechlorinators.

You can get a water analysis report from your water supplier that should detail the contents of your water. Not too sure exactly what is listed as it was a long time ago that I did this, one thing I remember was the faecal content. Apparently the water authorities are allowed to leave a certain amount of doo doo in your drinking water

Well thankyou adam that last comment has cheered me up a lot. Everybody watch out for a rise in Evian stock price, i think i've gone off tap water.

Hey we have a guy at BPF that uses Asdas own label bottle water to do his water changes, and he definatly doesnt have just the one tank either.

i was just wondering what brand off ro units you guys use and if you would recomend any brands over others i have just recently replaced my kent ro unit with a deltec unit both seemed good?

Chloramine needs a chemical reaction to break the chlorine/ammonia apart. That's where your dechlorinator comes into play.

Oh my goodness you poor souls. Having to fuss and muss with urban water must suck! If I had to play around with chemicals, tests, etc , I would definately give up fishkeeping.
I am so lucky I can turn on my tap and put the water right into my tanks.
Hurrah for being a country bumpkin! Well water rules!

I don't mean to burst your bubble but Well water is only as good as the land that surrounds it. If it happens to be farming land and the farmers like to use a bit of fertiliser then you could find that this could leach into the water table to give elevated nitrate readings. Just a thought.